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Head go *boom* (non-headache kind)

January 5th, 2007 (09:50 pm)

Since sooner or later, we're going to want to include notes for the 12 shinshou for Shoumyou, I've been fleshing out the notes that I've made so far for them. One site that I've been going through (primarily occult I guess; it has things on Shinto, Buddhism, divination, onmyoudou...) and the information for the 12shinshou aside (some of it's quite confusing to try to write out) I happened to take a look on the page for the protective slips of paper commonly seen in Ghost Hunt. The site even has instructions on how to make your own provided you know what to write inside. And at the bottom of that page... Mar 9, Jun 2, Sep 6, Dec 2 (old calendar) are days in which you are not to start using these charms as they're unlucky days. O_o

And while reading the novels and short stories for Shoumyou, I ran into a strange contradiction about Guren's circlet. O_o The novels have been pretty consistent about the circlet and what it represents, but the sidestory about the first monster that Masahiro and Guren battled gives a slightly different explanation for it. Could it be that its meaning changed from that first SS to its current meaning in the novels? From the publication dates, they don't seem too far off from one another but it might be enough?

Otherwise, I finally tracked down the initial scene in Ep 13 in the books and it was in an SS not one of the novels as I'd first thought. ^^; Masahiro, shame on you! It doesn't matter that you were (more than) half-asleep! ^^;;

[*uchigi--a form of clothing, either the outer layer of women's wear or an inner layer for men--these are commonly seen being used as covers in Shoumyou (commonly used in said manner during that era?)]

Kyo's winters are harsh. There's nothing colder than drafty houses like wind tunnels. The great onmyouji Abe no Seimei's youngest grandchild, Abe no Masahiro was currently 13. He'd laid out his bedding on top of the tatami mats, wrapped himself up in several uchigi, and holding something white, he was lightly snoring away.

The living creature that Masahiro was holding. This one was also blissfully asleep. It had a body like a cat, was about the size of a large cat or small dog, and its pure white fur looked very soft to the touch. The long ears flowed to the back and there was a flower-like red pattern on its forehead. At the ends of its four feet were five sharp claws, and there was a ring of protrusions around its neck like a necklace of magatamas. A non-human creature. Masahiro had taken to calling this living creature Mokkun the Mononoke.

Masahiro was a page at the Onmyouryou. It was almost time for him to get up and get ready to go to work, but there were no signs of his waking any time soon.

The door quietly opened and a small shadow entered. The shadow knelt beside Masahiro and, stretching out a hand, shook Masahiro.

"...Unnn... just a little longer..."

Masahiro reached out his hand and dragged the other person into the covers with him.


There was a light scream and Masahiro, who was more than half-asleep, paid no attention to it.

Red-faced, the girl fought her way out from under the covers and took several deep breaths.

"You're going to work today aren't you? Come now."

Getting shaken some more, Masahiro resignedly opened his eyes. And after a moment of blankly looking up at the person who'd come to wake him, he suddenly gaped and jerked awake.


"What, what is it?"

The mononoke Masahiro had been holding jumped awake at that yell.

"Good morning."

Getting nicely smiled at, Masahiro tried to calm his racing heart and muttered, "...Akiko shouldn't come to wake me..."

"My, but I'm imposing on this residence. So I should help out Tsuyuki-sama."

Tsuyuki is Masahiro's mother.

"No, that's not what I meant... Oh, never mind."

Masahiro sighed and gave up.

**skip narrative about why Akiko came to be staying at the Abe residence**

When he opens his eyes, Akiko's there. He still wasn't used to this situation and it was extremely hard on his heart. The mononoke that had been stretched out in Masahiro's lap until then yawned widely and said, "Get used to it already. How about turning the tables and telling her, 'I want you to be the first thing I see when I open my eyes from now on'?

Masahiro scuttled back. What a thing to say!

"But even so," the mononoke continued, "what're you doing remaining fast asleep when someone comes up to you, Seimei's grandson?"

Instantly, Masahiro's brow rose. Grabbing the mononoke he yelled in its ear, "Don't call me 'grandson'!"

Anyhow, back to GH 7 and then 8. :P


Posted by: Too cute for evil (ginny_t)
Posted at: January 6th, 2007 01:12 pm (UTC)
Shoumyou - *wai!*

Oh my. Not wasting any time at all, Masahiro?

I was pleased to see Masahiro's mother. Too many men in the Abe family!

*waits impatiently for information on the circlet* (Also, what is a magatama? I guess I could ask Uncle Wiki, but Shadow is so knowledgeable…)

I shall start assembling 12 shinshou screen caps. (Is it always "12 shinshou" and never just "shinshou"?)

Posted by: Too cute for evil (ginny_t)
Posted at: January 6th, 2007 01:19 pm (UTC)
library by skellorg on obsessiveicons

*surfaces briefly* Now I remember why I ask you instead of Wikipedia…

*falls back into wiki-tangle*

(Send help in a day or two.)

Posted by: Shadow (kagedreams)
Posted at: January 7th, 2007 01:40 am (UTC)

I'd send tea, but I'm not sure if that would mean you'll stay lost longer. ^^; I tend to get lost in there too if I'm not careful. >.<

As for the circlet, the first part is innocuous:

There was a gold circlet on his forehead almost like proof of something.

But the second part throws question although it could be taken as a possibility and not actual:

That circlet on his forehead might be to show that he'd submitted to being Seimei's shiki.

Posted by: Too cute for evil (ginny_t)
Posted at: January 7th, 2007 12:07 pm (UTC)
Shoumyou - light into my life

Interesting… I thought it was something completely different, based on what happens in ep. 9.

Posted by: Shadow (kagedreams)
Posted at: January 7th, 2007 06:00 pm (UTC)

Whoops. Sorry, that's the SS lines. The novel puts it as:

Among the 12 shinshou, Touda alone bore a golden circlet on his forehead. Touda had begged Seimei for and been given that seal.

In the anime, they don't actually have that narrative, so Rikugou and Seimei's comments explain what happened and what the circlet was:

R: The golden circlet--the seal--Seimei had given him...

S: Guren... have you been so hurt again, so much as to destroy that seal...?


That's why it struck me as a bit odd between the SS and the novels. ^^;

Posted by: We're only several miles from the sun (animegoil)
Posted at: January 6th, 2007 04:33 pm (UTC)

Cute ^_^ Question though, you keep saying 'novels' meaning... written out. So, not mangas?

Posted by: Shadow (kagedreams)
Posted at: January 7th, 2007 01:42 am (UTC)

I'm afraid so. ^^; I haven't seen any signs of when the manga might come out in tankoubon form. I've seen people comment about the manga on rare occasion, but haven't read them (main story) myself. ^^; (I've read a couple of the SS manga).

Posted by: Jorsen (jorsen)
Posted at: January 8th, 2007 05:37 am (UTC)

I'll say this: I found three Toudas in the anime/manga world.
Yami no Matsuei - big black serpent shikigami with hell fires, imprisoned for killing without regard; released to a shinigami master with a visor that limits his power.
Shounen Onmyouji: shikigami with hell fires under a onmyoudo master with a limiter to his power, who has problems controlling his power.
Heard of a manga Qwan, which has a Touda, a giant serpent, a guardian of a forest.
Also, heard that there are mention of Seiryuu, Suzaku, Byakko, Genbu, a Touda and a Kouchin in the interpretations of the I'Ching. Last, that there are instances of a Touda mentioned in ancient Chinese poetry.
To me that says that there is a common source for the concept of Touda in either Japanese or Chinese mythology or Shinto, Buddhism, Hinduism, Tao etc. However, during the 6 months that I searched for anything in the English-language internet on either any kind of Touda, or any 12 Heavenly Generals that consist of either a part or a whole of the Yami no Matsuei or the Shounen Onmyouji shikigami list, I found absolutely NOTHING. Down to the point that it is unclear, what elements Seiryuu and Genbu represent (wood and water or water and earth), or how, not just hell fire, but any kind of fire came to be associated with a serpent within any combination of the above-mentioned religions. With this void in information, ANY light on Touda or the 12 Heavenly Generals (that lists Seiryuu, Byakko, Suzaku, Genbu and Kouchin) will be highly appreciated.

Posted by: Shadow (kagedreams)
Posted at: January 9th, 2007 05:09 am (UTC)

I'm not sure about English sources for info. Seiryuu, Genbu, Suzaku, and Byakko are listed in Wikipedia and I suspect information should be relatively available for them on the 'net. (They're also called the shijin or four gods. I've also seen them called the four heavenly or divine beasts.) I think they're often depicted in tumuli in Japan and they guard the four cardinal directions (although Seiryuu and Byakko don't seem to be on cardinal directions among the 12 shinshou...).

From a passing comment in Shoumyou (assuming you can use that as any basis), I suspect that the original source for the 12 shinshou might lie with the text on the Five Elements and was then imported to Japan. As it is, all the shinshou have an element associated with them (hence fire for Touda) and Seiryuu and Genbu are wood and water respectively. (At least all the sources I've read have agreed on that part). ^^;

FWIW, I'm still gathering info on the 12shinshou and hope to get it into some semblance of making *sense* soon. ^^; It's currently quite the mess. >.

Posted by: Jorsen (jorsen)
Posted at: January 9th, 2007 07:09 pm (UTC)

FWIW, I'm still gathering info on the 12shinshou and hope to get it into some semblance of making *sense* soon. ^^; It's currently quite the mess. >

Yes, you mentioned it before, in your previous post, which sort of gave me hope that the info you have could give me a lead for a new search. Because it IS a mess. Because everything I found... (Gloomily) Well, this link could be used as a summary:
http://www.onmarkproductions.com/html/ssu-ling.shtml. That is the short version on the Shijin. If you press 12 Generals, you'll get the Juuni Shinshou. No doubt lovers of Samurai Deeper Kyo would have recognized quite a few names from the list. It even has a snake and a dragon in it. Too bad they are the wrong ones.

And the info in this link http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hell made me ask the question about the concept of any animal with hell or hell fires.

English Wikipedia has this to say about shikigami: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shikigami. Unfortunately, they, as yet, have nothing on the Twelve Heavenly Generals, who were supposed to have been among Abe no Seimei's shikigami.

A yahoo search for rikujin or rikujin chokuban gave me this: http://eos.kokugakuin.ac.jp/modules/xwords/entry.php?entryID=198 .

And this is from my recent correspondence on LJ:
"...There's a wikipedia page for 十二神将(http://ja.wikipedia.org/wiki/%E5%8D%81%E4%BA%8C%E7%A5%9E%E5%B0%86 ) on the twelve gods, in japanese. Not much specific information, except that they are the shikigami of Abe no Seimei and their attributes. The six gods (the 4 famous one... together with Touda and Kouchin) actually have their origin in Yi Jing...There's a detailed description of the characteristics of the six gods at this site http://www.iqing.net/2005/lbjc/053113435133563.htm (in Chinese).

There are many articles (http://news.xyef.com/042005/13/157503.html) detailing the method of assigning the six gods to the hexagrams..."

Admittedly, I have not yet gotten to having those links translated for me, which will be a must for me, as I don't know a word of either Japanese or Chinese.

And that is all, at least for now. Exasperatingly little info, which is why I'm still searching for any leads for more (groan).

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